Islam Sucks
There, I have said it.
Does the sound of a Godless American saying those words make you wince? Are you secretly cheering? Are you searching your mind for some reason to think otherwise? Hey, don't bother. Take my word for it. Islam today is a stinky mess of a religion.
Ah, that feels so good. How wonderful it is to live in a country where, at this point anyway, I am free to offer an opinion that may offend someone.
Before returning to my more general rant, I will take a moment to comment on the obvious absurdity and contradiction that is the latest yell-fest in the land of Islamic idiots. Basically, Muslims are burning churches and rioting violently because the suggestion has been made that at some point in history Islam was violent. Wow, way to make a point you morons!
While I find myself constantly having to battle to keep from being second-classed in this country because I am not religious, at least I don't have to worry about being killed or fire-bombed for my frequent negative comments about our dominant religion - Christianity. Hell, I will say it now that I would much rather live in a Christian dominated country than in any Islamic country, given a choice. What sane person would not?
It is beyond me how a religion and people can remain stuck in the middle ages while trillions of dollars flow into it from all corners of earth for the one useful commodity that they have - oil. The sooner that we all find a substitute for oil so as to cut off the money supply which has kept the backward nations of Islam even remotely relevant, the better. Sorry, but I have absolutely had it with the bunch of nuts in the desert who seem to suffer from an idea that anyone who insults their religion should be killed. Screw them!
I have also had it with all people, both secular and religious, who make excuses for the atrocities of Islam, which are numerous. Are people that afraid of these nuts? Do you want to live in a world where your leaders apply laws banning certain speech in order to appease the intolerant and violent Muslims? Do you want Islam to determine what the limits of free speech are? I know that I don't.
And that is why I have written this post. I will not ever silence myself from openly criticizing ANY religion. I am happy to that I live in a world in which most western countries have been secularized and liberalized enough to realize the value of open, honest and yes, insulting dialogues.
posted by Alan @ 9/16/2006 10:48:00 PM
21 Comments:
"Hell, I will say it now that I would much rather live in a Christian dominated country than in any Islamic country, given a choice."
Be careful here. We really haven't seen a true Christian theocracy in modern times. I'm certainly not defending Islam in any way, but it should be pointed out that what we are seeing is the result of Islamic theocracy where the religious nuts have the power to do whatever they want. Imagine giving that same power to Falwell, Robertson, etc.
If there is a doom to this world it will come from religion.
If there is a doom to this world it will come from religion.
Eric, I totally agree. Religious disagreement usually ends up being the bloodiest.
As for Islam...I am with Alan...if I had a choice to live under an xian dominated society or islam...I would be insane to not choose xianity.
When a xian lunatic blows something up or hurts or kills people in this country, he/she is quickly brought to justice. (Take David Koresh for instance who believed he was Jeebus and armed himself in a fort with lots of ammo.) In Islamic countries, when a suicide bomber "succeeds" in his/her "mission" they all cheer in the streets praising allah and rejoicing that infidels were killed and the suicide bomber goes to the great brothel in the sky.
Xianity is made fun of on a regular basis. When did we last see an xian suicide bomber or killing over a Freethunk! or Frenetic Wanderings cartoon portraying gawd in all kinds of sacreligious ways?
As for saying that xianity was "just as bad" in past history...that does not justify or give reason to be "tolerant" of muslim violence. Two wrongs don't make a right. I CAN imagine what would happen if Falwell or Robertson were given that type of power...but they don't have that power...but muslim extremists and terrorist groups do. One is a scenerio, one is present reality. Muslim children right here in this country are being "lovingly" taught to hate western culture and to perpetuate the islamic religion and ways to "glorify" allah and one day they hope to "reign" over all the earth for allah. I have been researching the websites of muslim schools and religion is the #1 priority. If Xians and Muslims alike could do their thing and believe what they choose without imposing it on others, then it would be tolerable. But that is not what the Abrahamic religions teach. They are death cults that are more concerned with the "hereafter" than living in the now...and one of those groups wants to expedite the infidels to hell without waiting for their gawd to do it.
I would also like to point out that *ALL* religions are intolerant of the truth and science ( to larger or lesser degrees ). We are safe, generally, in the US only because of the rule of law not the Xians running around. I have no doubt that the Xians would do the same thing here if they felt they could get away with it.
in the US only because of the rule of law not the Xians running around. I have no doubt that the Xians would do the same thing here if they felt they could get away with it.
This is an important point and is why we atheists must be constantly informed of what is going on with all religious agenda in this country and to work to maintain separation of church and state.
I agree that if xtianity became the law of the land, things would eventually get as bad as the countries where Islam is the law of the land. But western xtians have become so accustomed to the liberal nature of our governments that I don't think most could or would ever go back to the ways of the dark ages. Most of them realize how much better it is under our current system and probably fear the Jerry Falwells or other right-wing nuts as much as we do - eventhough they are not inclined to speak out about it. Perhaps I am giving them too much credit.
The big difference is that Islam has not progressed to recognize the value of a secular society and laws based on reason and commone sense rather than laws based on what some idiot in the desert said.
dear mr alan
i really was'nt surprized by the way you was speaking .... because you may only see in one direction and one time.....
look mr alan you may don't know that in words the HOLY QURAAN the dirict words of the GREAT ALLAH said " don't offence other relegion inorder others don't offence Allah agressivly whithout knowing what they say"
and it was obvious to me that you mr don't read any thing about history of islam and know that Muslims are the only people that rise and never treated jwe or christian badly.....
and i'm sure that you do'nt know that in words it's written in Quraan : " never force any one to be Muslim " ..... and even without oil we will not rise unless we worship Allah the only God and raise this world... by the way oil was discover b4 only 100s of years....
you know .....i'll ask you to read the HOLy QURAAN and then say if this quraan say any bad about any one... and this is a web site that offer free downlaod
http://www.islamtomorrow.com/quran/
by the way the great man who did this website is amirican and not fool.... as you :)
finally Muslim feel angry when you offense islam not because you simly offinse your God who creats you and gives your breath ....
May Allah show you truth roads and help you to take it
Dear Mr Shiroqou,
Had your response been just a bit more predictable - like most 'cookie cutter' responses that unthinking Islamists write - I might have thought it was a joke.
First, I am not an Islamist. I will never be an Islamist. So Allah has jack shit to do with me. He is YOUR God and belief in him and his prophet will probably lead you to a very miserable life of semi-poverty, denial of your humanity and will no doubt have a negative effect on others you come into contact with. Do you realize what an automated robot your response sounds like? It is the same response you see over and over again from Islamists when they react to infidels. However, I am sure that if we were in another country the reaction would not be in words would it, Mr Shiroqou? How would you handle an Infidel, an Atheist no less, disputing the words of Allah in Jordan where you live?
You see, your words about Islam being so great and wonderful are just what we call Bull Shit around here Mr Shiroqou. We aren't blind you know. We see what Islam does in the countries that it controls. We see how women are treated, murdered by their families, hanged for supposed infidelity. We have eyes and can see the TRUTH of what an Islamic world would be like and we don't like it.
As far as the history of Islam goes, it is littered with blood, conquest and atrocities just as Christian history is. The difference is that Islam is STILL committing those atrocities and looks to continue to do so until it brings about its own destruction or takes over the world. BTW, the later option is NOT going to happen, Mr Shiroqou.
So please save your tired and old B.S. about Islam for some poor convert to some other religion. I am an ATHEIST. My eyes have been opened to the foolishness of all religions. One would only need half of one eye opened to see the idiocy of your religion, Islam.
Cheers Alan, I didn't know where to start with that post... a spell checker or the history books.
People who believe in the supernatural will always be blind to the truth of the world around them and nothing short of personal enlightenment will change that.
Religious people who believe in a god should stop and ask themselves why this all powerful god never shows himself, and why he needs idiotic and "imperfect" people to interpret a message written down by imperfect humans and relay their version of this message to other people. Why doesn't this god ever show himself to everyone and give his message firsthand if this is a life or death matter and be done with the violence and the games? It's because this god, Allah or whatever DOES NOT EXIST except in the minds of weak men who WANT to believe.
If one stops believing, nothing happens to the unbeliever except at the hands of other superstitious humans.
God believers all take some book that was written so long ago by primitive people and believe it to be true. It would be like people thousands of years from now finding Tolkein's works and declaring them to be sacred and everyone worshipping a Hobbitt and going to buildings with a golden ring symbol on top and praying to the almighty spirit of Gandalf.
The other problem about religion is that these people have had so much fear instilled in them that this god is going to send them to some awful imaginary place after they are dead that they fail to live the only life they have in the here and now. Sad...sad for people like shiroqou.
I also don't understand why religious-types are always demanding "read my religous text."
"i'll ask you to read the HOLy QURAAN"
No thanks, pal. Why should I waste my time reading your book? Why don't you read my religious book--"Moby Dick"? (which at least can compete with other religious texts for length and literary impenetrability.)
You are right about Islam. It is perhaps the single greatest threat to progress and human rights in the world- and most people are either too ignorant or too afraid to acknowledge that. The fact that premedeival superstition continues to dominate human thought is truly amazing.
Extremely provocative dialogue here, and your analysis gives me pause.
I should qualify myself as an "agnostic", meaning that I believe there is a possibility that there is a God, but that I don't claim to know one way or another. I certainly don't subscribe to the tenets or dogma of any major religion, or even minor religion for that matter; however, I do attempt to live my life on some sort of moral plane.
From a purely superficial standpoint, I agree that in current forms, Islamic culture presents a far more terrifying worldview than that of their counterpart Christian cultures.
But I think that argument only takes into context the incendiary reactions of one religion when another disparages it in specific moments - like the pope's commentary on the dark history of Islam.
But the bigger picture is missing here.
Step outside of this discussion for a moment and make a moral judgement over who the "worse" people were in these two unrelated situations:
A) The citizens of South Central Los Angeles during the 1992 riots - poor, uneducated African-Americans who set fires, looted, and even beat innocent caucasian bystanders nearly to death.
B) The leading figures of the corporate scandals at the beginning of this decade: Ken Lay, Bernard Ebbers, Dennis Kozlowski, Sam Waksal - wealthy, educated, caucasian males who have never been convicted of violent crimes, but whose offenses have financially destroyed the lives of literally thousands of former employees and have even led some into depression and suicide.
Whose crimes are worse?
The angry black youths who violently beat Reginald Denny unconscious?
The corporate fatcats who treated themselves to million dollar birthday parties while their employees lost their homes to foreclosure because of their bosses malfeasance?
Why is this relevant to the discussion of "violent Muslim culture" versus "violent Christian culture"?
Because "violence" is something that we too easily attribute to things which are graphically disturbing to us, while at the same time totally ignoring many of its more subversive and sinister forms.
If you flip-flopped the economic wealth and power of the Muslim world with that of the Christian world, you would also see a world in which Muslims were relatively "peaceful" (on the surface) and Christians were bombing sidewalk cafes with frequency.
Oppressed cultures of all backgrounds are angry, and will often result to violence when all else fails. Even some of the most famous atheist-leaning cultures in history - the Bolsheviks - utilized violence as a means to an end to overthrow a tyrannical Christian regime.
Caged animals - including humans - tend to behave violently. The Middle East has been the caged animal of the West for a long time, notably during the 1980s in which our OWN country was supplying weapons to Saddam Hussein and the future Taliban using them as pawns against our enemies at the time.
What is happening now is that the chickens have come home to roost. A culture that is impoverished and treated as a second class citizenry on the global stage is fighting back. And they are being led by angry zealots who are tapping into their own personal frustration with their lot in life - a lot that has been dealt to them in large part at the hands of tyrannical Western (Christian influenced) policies which have left them raped and pillaged.
Christians don't detonate themselves in the streets of Anytown, USA because they are too busy enjoying their Starbucks Coffee while listening to their Ipods and deciding whether they will be getting the H2 or the more affordable H3 next year.
Indeed, it is fair to say that Islamic culture in today's world behaves more "primitively" while Christian culture carries the appearance of being more "civilized", but it really is only a matter of economics.
Take the Christian out of the affluent racist, homophobic, mysoginistic suburbs and put him in the gritty crime-ridden ghetto, he's eventually going to act like a ghetto kid...
Take the Muslim out of that ghetto and put him in the suburbs, he'll start to behave "civilized"...
Bigger than the debate about religion is the debate about the good and evil of power and power structures. Those who hold the most power have always succeeded in propagating their search for more power utilizing "civilized" tactics - they give their friends tax cuts, good jobs, exclusive social connections - and they work hard to ensure that those on the outside will remain on the outside.
Just some stuff to chew on, for what it's worth...
Take the Muslim out of that ghetto and put him in the suburbs, he'll start to behave "civilized"...
Well, now......... If you'll remember, Muhammad Atta of 911 infamy came from a rich family.
No one in our government likes to bring up the fact that Saudis, rich as Midas, fund a lot of this hate and discontent while simultaneously smiling at the hand that feeds them (us).
First of all let me say this message is for anyone who is curious or on a quest for the truth. Secondly let me say I absolutely defend your (the author of “Islam Sucks”) right to free speech and respect the fact that you have chosen to practice it. I wish to communicate this to you as a friend simply attempting to teach another something they might not already know. I also would like to thank you for taking the initiative to voice your frustration and anger. It has generated an environment that has the potential to bring about constructive enlightening debate. I also believe that it is illogical for anyone to be insulted in such an environment, because the intention is to inform and to understand not to insult (and intention is everything).
Essentially what I wish to say is simple. There is ideology/theory and then there is actually/practice/reality. We must learn to distinguish between these two if we want to truly grasp what is going on in the world, especially when it comes to religion.
Being born a Muslim and raised in a happy vibrant, academic home with very cultural, scholastic, loving parents I will argue that Islam’s Ideology is not regressive, savage, hypocritical, and evil. Though I, personally, do not agree with everything that is written in the Koran that does not mean those teachings are evil, savage, regressive or uncivilized. Just because a certain moral perspective or approach to an Ideal society does not sit comfortably with my intuitions about fairness and justice, just because it just doesn’t “sound” right or “feel” right, does not mean it is wrong. As an astrophysics major I can confidentially tell you that if humanity were to follow its institutions and “gut feelings” with the experimental sciences we would never have technologically progressed to where we are today. We must also keep this in mind when attempting to understand the human experience and morality. The very first words that were revealed to the prophet Muhammad were “Read, Read in the name the god that created you”. So it is certainly a religion that promotes the act of reading but more fundamentally the acquisition of knowledge. I will also argue that most religions (certainly all of the ones that I am educated on) do not promote death, destruction, misery and poverty.
For reasons other than the teachings of Islam or any religion people are evil, people are tribal, people are savage, people are murderous, people are hypocritical, people are irrational, people are uneducated, people are uncivilized, people are dishonest, people are confused, people are brainwashed and people are hateful. I am sure most of us know enough history to know way before Judaism, Christianity and Islam many people, if not more than now were that way. I will stereotype and make the somewhat prejudice comment and say that a significant percentage of the people in the Arab world are that way. Islam itself makes a similar claim, even more harshly against the Arabs and thus goes on to explain that it is god’s plan to reveal his teachings amongst the most troubled and morally degenerated people, as it had done so before with the Israelites and the people who surrounded them like the ancient Egyptians and the Romans.
It would be useless and extremely time consuming to sit here and attempt to philosophically discuss/defend via this medium of communication, this online posting system, the specific Islamic teachings that you argue are bull shit or evil (I have a feeling the list is long) but I can summarize and give you the real life tangible explanation. The world of Islam extends far beyond that of the troubled Arab world, it extends to my parents. They along with the countless other Muslim families who do not kill, act violently, hate, promote terrorism and are not male controlled/dominated/favored but instead are fun, loving, caring, generous, knowledgeable, educated, civilized people are living proof that Islam is not what you believe it is for it were it could not produce a single true follower like them. They are Muslim and at the same time they are those things, and if anybody takes the time and effort to investigate this claim here in the states, they will find it to be true.
I believe that it was my moral responsibility to write this post because I believe maybe just maybe it could enlighten one person and give them the knowledge they need to rise above their ignorance (the ignorance that out of no fault of their own they have accumulated – the “genuinely mislead”). I sympathize and feel for those who despite of these words feel the same as the author of “Islam Sucks”, for conquering ignorance is probably the hardest thing a person can do. I am constantly trying to overcome mine.
The bloodiest disagreements have been about religion? Haven't studied your history much have you Eric and Stardust? (by the way, the use of "x" because you guys are either afraid the type the word.. gasp... Christ, or just too lazy to type is really silly), Hitler wasn't a religious fanatic, but millions died from his expansion throughout Europe and Africa. The Japanese slaughtered millions of Chinese, secular society. Joseph Stalin, devout athiest, millions dead under his authority. Chairman Mao, atheist, countlesss killed during his societal cleansing. Cambodia? Vietnam after the U.S. left?
Religion is always in disagreement with science? My god, do you really not read any source documents or do research?
Sir Francis Bacon, founder of the modern scientific method.
Robert Boyle, father of chemistry.
Johann Kepler, founder of physical astronomy.
Blaise Pascal, father of hydrostatics and analytic geometry.
Sir Isaac Newton, recognized as the greatest scientist of all time, discovered the law of gravity, invented calculus and was foundational in the discipline of dynamics. Yet he wrote in support of the literal accuracy of the Bible.
These and many others were actually defenders and believers in Christianity, so to insinuate that the two cannot coexist is simply ignorant. These founders believed that God was complimented by science. But at least you can type, unlike Shiroqou.
And to equate Christianity in the same vein as Islam is just shortsighted and stupid. America for all its faults is worlds better than ANYTHING under muslim control, especially if you are a woman. Unless you missed the "Honor Killing" of Du’a Khalil Aswad, a 17 year old girl that fell in love with somebody of the wrong faith. Honor killing my ass. The scum cowards that carried it out should be lined up and summarily shot. Men kicking and beating a teen girl to death, great religion, damn savages.
You know what I don't see in this that is the biggest condemnation of Islam is the huge congregations in the streets protesting acts of terrorism, protesting the abhorent murder of a teenage girl's "Dishonor Killing", protesting the murder of Daniel Pearl, protesting the bombings in London. Your silence condemns you. Condemns you as silent supporters of scum that think killing women and children because the happen to be American or Jewish is somehow getting them some grind time with 70 virgins, what a joke.
Take the Muslim out of the ghetto? Let's see, most of those hijackering scum on 9/11 were from wealthy Saudi families. Osama, from an extremely wealthy family. Sorry, not buying the poor victim argument on that one.
Islam does in fact suck. When I start seeing mass demonstrations for peace, and the condmenation of terrorism, the condemnation of Honor Killings, the condemnation of the murder of Jewish people simply for being Jewish, then perhaps I could entertain a different point of view.
Hell Ya Islam sucks. Just last night I saw the Hamas Mickey Mouse version teaching kids hatred. Whats even funnier than that is they call the mouse a butterfly. Damn you people suck @$$. Why dont you just take your sucky religion and go to hell and stay there.
you know what sucks? the muslims that do like america and the freedoms we give are being targeted by those religious nuts.
i think we should get the non-extremist islams who support america, train them and send them to infiltrate the extremists and poison their food/water and sabotage their plans.
what we need is another good old fashioned Crusade. get the red crosses on white shields out and burn down radical islamists then other extreme religious nuts.
Salam/Peace/Shalom,
Actually there is a lot of ignorance being quoted and mentioned and no this is not a robotic answer it is from a female who is proud to have found Islam and proud to be a Muslim.. By the way you do not speak for me or the millions of other Muslim sisters around the world when talking about how we are treated... Have you ever asked yourself why the vast number of people converting to Islam are women... do u really think it is to be hanged? or treated the way you described it...
Do not be so ignorant as to blame all the problems on religion and do not use God as the scapegoat..
I have the deepest respect for the 3 Monotheistic religions and that is what Islam taught me too..
So mouthing your what you believe the media tells you thoughts off will not do you any good... I think you really need to look at who is the robot and who is programmed to say such things me or you...
Open your mind for once and have some respect for others and before you mouth off again I am not living in the dark ages, I am alive in this century living a modest life with as much spirituality as I can find away from the rat race....
Peace and Blessings to all people of all races and all religions, regardless of creed, colour, race, and economic status...
This post has been removed by the author.
Well, I am a 15 year old "Muslim teen" (according to my parents) and within the past couple of months I've been confused with religion. Specifically confused with the aspect of whether there is a "divine creator" or not. So far I have weighed the evidence and I find that I am not longer apart of this mess of a religon called "islam".
The more I listened to "religiously educated" people the more I realised that my parents and my families religion is completely terrible, controlling and brainwashing. From "muslim experience" I can say that you are 100% right that "Islam Sucks". Even though I may not believe a word of the Bible or Quran, sometimes it boils down to the religions' morals and Islam has terrible morals.
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